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Show Notes
In this episode of Witch Hunt, we dive into an enlightening conversation with Neelesh Singh, a champion for social inclusion and gender equality with India’s National Rural Livelihood Mission. Neelesh emphasizes the urgent imperative to confront and mitigate gender-based violence at every stage of life, highlighting the importance of comprehensive strategies that protect and empower individuals from infancy through to old age.From combating infanticide to empowering widow survivors of witchcraft allegations, Neelesh’s work spans a broad spectrum of initiatives aimed at fostering resilience, healing, and collective empowerment among women in rural India. Learn about therapeutic approaches including art therapy for expression and healing, the formation of women’s collectives to combat domestic violence, and the development of strategies for prevention, risk mitigation, and redressal of gender-based violence. Neelesh also discusses the importance of survivor networks in influencing policy and media, underscoring the critical role of the state in acknowledging and combating these practices. Join us for a profound discussion on the journey towards gender equity and the end of witch hunts for alleged witches in India.
Witch Hunts in Ghana & India by John Azumah & Neelesh Singh 10.13.21
Street Play on Witch Hunting by I-CARD
Stop Witchcraft Accusations and Trial by Ordeal in Guinea Bissau by Leo Igwe
Why Witch Hunts are not just a Dark Chapter from the Past
The International Network against Accusations of Witchcraft and Associated Harmful Practices
Grassroots organizations working with The International Network
International Alliance to End Witch Hunts
Transcript
Josh Hutchinson: Welcome to Witch Hunt, the podcast bringing you news about today's witch hunts. I'm Josh Hutchinson.
Sarah Jack: And I'm Sarah Jack. I descend from multiple women accused of witchcraft in colonial New England.
Josh Hutchinson: I also descend from several women who were accused before and during the Salem witch trials.
Sarah Jack: Just as these women did many years ago, women today continue to proclaim their innocence.
Josh Hutchinson: One person working to end these modern-day witch hunts is Neelesh Singh, who works for the National Rural Livelihood Mission in India, focusing on gender and social inclusion. His work involves various aspects of rural development, social audit, and addressing gender issues, with a [00:01:00] specific focus on preventing witch hunting.
Sarah Jack: Neelesh highlights that gender-based violence impacts women and girls of all ages, from before birth to old age, with a range of violence for different age groups.
Josh Hutchinson: Indeed, girls can be victims of infanticide, and older women, especially widows, are vulnerable to witchcraft allegations and the associated violence.
Sarah Jack: Beyond witch hunting, Neelesh and his team are developing comprehensive strategies to address various forms of gender-based violence, including prevention, risk mitigation, and redressal mechanisms.
Josh Hutchinson: An art therapy initiative was used to help women express their experiences through painting. As they grew in confidence, they began to transition from using old newspapers to using fresh drawing papers and a wider range of colors, symbolizing their journey of healing and empowerment.
Sarah Jack: Organizing women into collectives and educating them about gender issues is crucial, [00:02:00] and it's essential to create platforms within women's collectives where members can discuss private matters like domestic violence, challenging the stigma and fear associated with speaking out.
Josh Hutchinson: Neelesh emphasized the importance of building networks of witch hunt survivors, enabling them to influence policy and media coverage. He highlighted the need for the state to recognize its responsibility in addressing and preventing such practices.
Sarah Jack: And he shares some touching stories with us today. We are pleased to welcome Neelesh Singh, expert social inclusion and gender integrator with India's National Mission Management Unit. He has spent decades working in India's social development sector.
Sarah Jack: My name is Neelesh, and I'm working for agovernment scheme and centrally-sponsored scheme called National Rural Livelihood Mission. And I am in their gender and social inclusion vertical.This is a national level of scheme, and it is being implemented [00:03:00] in every states and union territories of India.
Neelesh Singh: AndI passed my post graduation from,institute called Xavier Institute of Social Services in 2000. I did my specialization in rural development.I initiated with tribal empowerment and slowly into the natural resource management and then to the social audit and totend to gender aspects.
Neelesh Singh: And it was like in 2016 that I got this opportunity to work on gender issues. So before that I didn't have much experience of working on gender issues, but, and, I was like, fortunate enough to initiate my work on gender issues with an issue which was burning there called witch-hunting.
Neelesh Singh: Yes. And I, for me also, it was like first of time when I was hearing such kind of. That's how I started working intensively for the prevention of witch hunting. And I had my team and we had some strategy to [00:04:00] do that. And then government supported us. Because I was the part of that time with the state government, I was working under the same scheme and then the national government, they also supported us and lots of other NGOs also joined us, and we could do it in a scale, and then a special project was designed around it.
Neelesh Singh: Continue to work on this and now we have designed to further, because different states has got different kind of gender issues. So we are now working on the entire gender-based violence, for the aspects of prevention and for the risk mitigation and forredressal mechanism and so everything we are trying to now work it and we are still growing.
Neelesh Singh: Does gender-based violence affect all ages of women?
Neelesh Singh: Yes. You know, there is a saying here 'from the womb to tomb.' It affects from when you are yet to born and it goes on until the tomb. We have got like [00:05:00] range of violence for different kind of age group, which runs across it. So yeah. For every age group.
Sarah Jack: You mentioned thatthe gender violence is a little different in every state or it presents itself in its own way. That must be a great challenge to have so many different entry points to address the issue.
Neelesh Singh: At the national level, we have got very different roles to play. The things comes from the bottom from the community itself. So every community, they prioritize their issues as per their need and as per they are affected by it and all.
Neelesh Singh: Many of the places, the issues are likethe state where I belong to. They have got witch hunting asone of the priority issue and then human trafficking is there. Domestic violence is almost there in almost every state is reporting [00:06:00] against domestic violence.
Neelesh Singh: Thenthe issues like child marriage. I can see wherever the incidence of poverty is high, you will find the incidence also of child marriages and such things are also high. Andthen we have got issues like dowry that here actually in India, we have this practice for the marriage.
Neelesh Singh: The bride's side, they have to give some money for getting married to the bridegroom. We call it the dowry system. It is like quite high, quite prevalent in several parts of the country and it's just very high. There's a cost for every bridegroom. So suppose if a girl is there and she wants to marry a doctor. What happens, there's two sides of it. One is that this girl has always, right from her birth, she has been brought up very differently. Here in India,we brought up our girl very different from the way we bring up our boys.While, they are, the boys would have [00:07:00] different aspiration and we will all support them. Like he wants to become doctor or engineer or whatever he wants to become. Every family member would try to support him, the father, mother, everybody would try to support this person. Girls child are largely, they are brought up like for being a very good wife. So they are like nurtured for being wife of somebody, and she can have dream of her bridegroom. She cannot dream about her own careers. Her career will be like a housewife. Housewife only, but she can dream about her bride groom. Okay? So I would want to marry a doctor. I would want to marry engineer. She cannot dream of becoming a doctor, becoming engineer. I don't like that. And higher aspirations are, the greater would be the price of the dowry that you have to pay. While in order to grow a boy child, the father would save the money and invest the money in his education. Here, father would save the money so that he can pay for the dowry. So he would try to [00:08:00] invest least on the education of the girl, so girl will be nurtured and will be taught, will be trained, as a good wife. So for doing the household chores and all these activities, while boys will be encouraged to go to a school and go to school and have good education.
Neelesh Singh: So this incidence of sometime it is though the parents and the child might have the dream of marrying a doctor, but their poverty, their economic status, that may not allow her and her parents to realize that dream. In the process, what happens that, and this is also based on the greed of the family, because this never ends, no?
Neelesh Singh: Suppose you say that 50 lakh is the amount that you need to pay for marrying this person. And then, even if you have paid 50 lakh, it doesn't stop you that asking this money again to her father. I know that you have paid 50 lakhs but I would need 10 more lakhs because now I have [00:09:00] to give education to the child, now she is giving birth to a girl child, so we have to do something. So they keep on asking, and this often leads to exploitations and also violence and extortion and all those things. So sometimes, so it leads to dowry death also.
Neelesh Singh: So you'll find lots of incidents. And all these incidents like human trafficking or domestic violence orwitch hunting ordowry or child marriage, all these things requires different kinds of strategies. It depends in which part of the country are you living and what kind of resources you have access to, and what kind of society do you, depending on what kind of culture do you have, what kind of accessibility you have. So all, depending upon all those things, you need to knit your strategy around it.
Neelesh Singh: One thing that we have in common under NRLM is that we form women-based groups. We call self help groups here. So here, NRLM is like one of, this is one of the program, National Rural Livelihood Mission. [00:10:00] In short, I'm calling it NRLM. This program islargest network of women collectives.
Neelesh Singh: Now, in the entire country, we have got more than 10 crew of now women who became part of our self help groups now. We try to keep this in our base that we need to build our strategy on these women collectives. So we promote women collectives to plan women collectives to take action against it, and we try to sensitize these women collectives against this, because, being, even though they, this is women collective, that doesn't mean that everybody will be very sensitive to the women issues.
Neelesh Singh: Sometime because they are from the same society, it takes some time and it takes time to understand what kind of system is existing there.How are they driver of the patriarchy and all those things. And by understanding all those things, by assessing the kind of gender sensitivity that they have, we need to, we have to plan their sensitization, their awareness, and their capacity building and all those things.
Neelesh Singh: And that's [00:11:00] how strategy is built upon. So there are several strategy. While we might have human trafficking there in most of the states, but our strategy might be very different in different part of the state, depending upon the different characteristics and resources that we have.
Josh Hutchinson: In your messages with us before the interview, you talked about the importance of collective action by women's collectives. What kind of action do you mean by that?
Neelesh Singh: Now let me give you the example ofincidents of witch-hunting and witch-branding. The foremost incident that I came across, there wasa member of our own women collective. She was, branded as witch by different people and eventually what happens, her own collective, her own self help groups, the people who have come together to help each other, they also started calling her witch. [00:12:00] And eventually what happened, her husband'sbig brother, elder brother, and his wife, both of them, they once decided to kill that lady, and they came with axe in her hand and then they try to attack her and she somehow she escaped from that house, but that didn't stop them to chase her and pull her down and all those things. But somehow she could save her life, but she couldn't save her house and her grains and all those things. Everything was put on fire.
Neelesh Singh: I raised this question to the collective that. While she was being branded, while she was being chased down by somebody, while somebody attempted to kill her, why is that, she was a member of your own group? Why didn't any of you came forward to help her? So they also said that because she's a witch, so killing a witch is, it's like saving everybody else. Otherwise she would have killed all of us. So it's like a good [00:13:00] thing.So that made us think again thatunless, until everyone is sensitized towards it, there's nothing we can do again becausepolice also couldn't take much action because nobody was ready to give any witness. No evidence was there.
Neelesh Singh: And then villagers shared several incidents in whichseveral of the lady who have been killed in the name of witch, no one had came forward to say against that crime or that well and nobody even knew that this is a crime. Everyone think that this is a good thing and they have done it for the collective goodness of everybody else.What was important is that at that time, at the peak of this hour, nobody was there in support of her. Even if some people wanted to support her, they were also, would have been killed eventually, because it is very hard to go against the entire crowd. You won't have that much of voice and that much of courage also. They would kill that woman in front of everyone.
Neelesh Singh: And I don't believe [00:14:00] that everyone would believe that this lady is a witch. I know there would be at least some supporter. Somebody would believe, her friend or maybe her daughter or her son, even her husband or maybe her parents, somebody would at least, would believe that this is not her. She has not killed that child. The child died because of fever and she was not around and she wouldn't have caused any fever to that child. Why are you saying that you have casted bad eyes? She, I don't think that she would have casted any bad eyes on that child and all those things.
Neelesh Singh: You cannot intervene at the time and people have started taking out their weapon, want to kill that person. At that time, it's very difficult to intervene. You're going to start intervening right from the beginning. You can start recognizing who are the person who believe in rationality, who are the person who believe that this violence is against only women. It is not against any man also, because all the cases that we have, I think more [00:15:00] 95% were women only, and all those 5% male people who have been killed in the name of witch they were also, they were only supporter tothat lady. So this is a weapon which man folks are using against their women to take control of the women and all. We had to build up this and we wanted that this discussion should to start happening in our group. Because our self help groups was not limited only for helping each other during the economic crisis. These are also the things where they can discuss all those things in their groups. When we were going through their minute books and in the meeting minutes books, we realized that they never discussed any kind of violence within their self help groups, like nobody would discuss about any domestic violence, even though they wanted to discuss these things, but never believed on any of their member. They thought that if we will tell them about that my husband has beaten me yesterday [00:16:00] night, this incidents will reach out to her husband and again, and then she will get more bashing after that when she go back home. And while everybody in that group was suffering from domestic violence at some point of time or other, but nobody was ready to help each other. Nobody had any belief in each other, so just a note. What we wanted to do is we wanted to make this platform as a platform which has got a greater credibility in which members can discuss about these things, as well. This is a very private thing to talk about, but we wanted them to be that close where they can discuss about the kind of violence that is going through or the kind of stigma, the kind of embarrassing moment that they are living every day. Somebody might be sleeping very hungry, but she needs to tell that.
Neelesh Singh: In India, I'm not sure about other part of the country, but in India, what happens that, if a lady gets beaten up by [00:17:00] the husband, she won't tell to anyone, she thinks that, that it is the honor of the family. So she, he has to take care of the honor of the family. So she will, if the husband's beats her in open, she will rush to the home, and she will close all the door, all the window. And then she will request her husband to keep his voice down, and then you can beat me, but keep your voice down. Nobody should listen to this. And then next day,she will try to remove all the strains from her face and everything, and then she'll go back to the work like that.I don't know why this burden is there on her. She's the victim, she's the survivor. We wanted them to believe that she is not the only savior of the honor and she. And there's some responsibility of males are also there in it, and she, it's okay if she shares her story, and it's okay that everyone tries collectively to stop each other's husband from doing it and seeking some legalservices if it requires so. There are like, [00:18:00] police are there,legal services are there, all these are meant for women also, and it's okay if they go and seek out this help. These poor,the only strength that they have, they don't have money, they don't have much resources with them, but the thing that they have is their collectiveness, their numbers, they're such a high number. And we are organizing them, making them organize is, I think, we are hoping that this will give strength to them against such a horrendous crime.
Sarah Jack: So I'm hearing you say that just bringing them together is just the start. They also have to be educated and encouraged to make positive responses together as a collective.
Neelesh Singh: We learn from different parts of the country because at the national level, we don't have any other geography to work on, but different states they work on, they have their own geography. So we learn [00:19:00] from different states.
Neelesh Singh: So we have got a state called Kerala here, and they also, they are like much mature state in the sense, they have got very old women collectives, so they, now it is more than 20 years or 30 years, I'm not sure. But it is that long that women have been organized, and they are now working on the gender issues. One of the strategy that they have is they map the crimes in the villages. So every village. Women collectively, along with the district administration, along with the government officials, they map crime, what kind of crime happens in which corner of the village,this is where domestic violence happened, this is where, so likewise, they, they map the crime, and then they also map, then they also do safety audit, with different kinds of women folks and of different age group. What happens is that maybe a pregnant woman and a lactating mother or an elderly women and a person with disability. All those women, they will walk [00:20:00] in the night and also in the day in different parts of that village, and will tell that what kind of incidents happens here and who among all of us they are feel safe here, or feel unsafe here, and what kind of incidents does happen.
Neelesh Singh: They can say that this road is not safe for pregnant women to walk on, or this road is not safe for, or this building is not safe fora person with disability to go into or take any services, or here people are not friendly about it. So, Likewise, they will map all the problems, and then they'll also come up with a solution. I think there is a CCTV, if you can put here, then it will serve some problem. If you can close down that liquor shop, I think that will also close down some issue. If you can just put some lights here, because there's so much of dark, and if you can put some light. So like this, they will also propose the solution. And that prevents so much of violence to happen. This comes into the village plan, village annual action plan of that village, which you can[00:21:00] follow up, which district admission can follow up with on a regular basis that this was the plan and this was what approved and how much of it has been really implemented and where is the gap?
Sarah Jack: You'd mentioned you also wanted to talk about the healing and empowerment of witch hunt survivors.
Neelesh Singh: During the initial period, what happened is thatwe had identified,we used to develop a theater team of rural women. We used to train them on theaters. So there was a person who was a professional theater person. So we hired his services for passing this skills on or training the women on theater.And then there, we also took the services of some of the organizations who were working on the legal issues for documenting the cases. So we made a group of10 people in each team. So there were several teams. So every team had 10 women who were trained on [00:22:00] theater and who were trained also on documenting the cases.
Neelesh Singh: And we would put that team in a village for two days or so. So they used to stay there also in the night. So two days and two nights, they need to stay there, and they would play this theater there. and then eventually what would happen is that somebody in the village would relate her story with the story which they were showing in the theater. And because they were staying in the same village, so the women who were already been branded as witch. She would relate her story with the story which they were showing in the theater, and they would, and she could, she can also access them because they were staying in the same village.
Neelesh Singh: So that's how they would identify the cases. They would identify the women who have been branded as witch.So becausethe experience has taught us that,first they will brand somebody as which, and after that only, maybe after some period of, after some years, after some months, or maybe after, some decades, they will kill them.[00:23:00]
Neelesh Singh: So they cannot kill anybody before they brand her as witch. So first they need to brand her witch. Then they needs to convince everybody that she's witch and then only this killing will happen or public lynching will happen. So our strategy was to identify such women who have been branded as witch and then to call up a public hearing in which we used to calljudiciary, police, and different government officials and panchayat people. All those publicfigures, we used to call them because it was ultimately, it was their responsibility for the security and safety of every citizen of India.
Neelesh Singh: So we'll call each of them and then we'll hand over this list to them,that, we are not making this list public, but we are handing over to you publicly,handing over this list to you personally so that you take care of the safety and security of this person. This person has been branded as witch, and we don't want this person to be get killed also. Soif that person is getting killed, then you should be [00:24:00] held accountable for that. So that's how they ensure the protection of that lady.
Neelesh Singh: So we used to identify such.This theater group, they used to go village after village. They used to cover every village, and they used to identify. In the first round, we identified 65 of them. When we covered in one go, we covered 40 villages of one block before we called for public hearing. So 65 lady were identified as witch, who have been branded as witch and they were living a very pathetic life in their own village. And this was the first time we were interacting with such women. And we called off all these women to a place herein a city. And it was aluxurious hotel, and we kept this workshop for three days there. And we had called our several partner who were champion in working on the gender-based violence. And we also had several trainers along with us.
Neelesh Singh: And when we were there in that hotel, and anything that we would ask them, we will ask, what is [00:25:00] their name? They would take so much of time to speak out their name. And their tears were not stopping, and they were just crying. And I think by the lunch, they said that this is the first time that after such a long period of, somebody was saying 10 years or 20 years, that somebody was interacting with them and that they are getting such a good food and so many people are giving respect to them. They're talking to her, all those things. And this was,we got moved by their gestures, by their tears and everything. That's where we got to know that just saving their life is not enough. They also need to live their life and they need to live their life very normally. You know, we need to normalize all those things, and they need to come out from that fear. And they, everybody, the kind of incidents that the ladies were sharing,one of them,
Neelesh Singh: so [00:26:00] one of the lady, she said that her house is situated,at the end of the village, somewhere in the corner of the village. It was made oftwigs and straw and all those things, bushes and all those things. It was made of, it was like just one kick and the entire house will collapse. That kind of hut, it was a hut. Andshe was saying that every day, every night and in every night, somebody would come and will pass urine on the wall of the house. Some of the urine will also enter the house from there because it is anyway made of some thatches and some twigs and all those things, so the winds can pass on from that. So urine will also pass from that while, and it doesn't matter where she's sleeping or cooking or whatever she might be doing, but this person will pass urine and will say, 'look, my child is sick, and I know that you have casted bad eye, your bad [00:27:00] eyes.By morning, if my child is not okay, then I am going to kill you.' And this will happen to her almost every night. Somebody in the entire village would fall in. Somebody will lost something or maybe somebody will suffer from some pain, and she would become the cause for that. Everybody would believe that she's the cause for that.
Neelesh Singh: And living a life like that for such a long period was like. I cannot even imagine such a horrendous life to be. what we thought is,and if you cannot, you need to bring her out from the kind of suffering that she is undergoing and the kind of state of mind that she's living in, and we are talking about so many people here. They might be very elderly, or they might be very at the end of their life, but still they deserve a good life to lead and whatever life is left for them. So that time, we thought that some counseling would be okay for them. [00:28:00] So we did organize for some counseling and butafter that we thought that there has to be some way in which we can continuously engage with them. So one thing which occurred to all of us was,let us give them training on theater and make them as part of our theater group. And they can go to different villages and aware people against witch-hunting and because they can share their own story and that will be real story and they can influence people like they can understand the pain they're going through.
Neelesh Singh: And we have seen that just giving them like our, the trainer who used to give training on theater, when he saw the entire participants, all of them were like above the age of seventies. That was a challenge for him. He has never taught such elderly people on theater, but that was just like six training, six day residential training.
Neelesh Singh: But that slowly he understood the [00:29:00] power that they had, and the six days when they were staying together and they were discussing about all those things, it gave them so much of space for sharing their story and learning from them and opening up and all those things. And when they became the part of the theater group, when they learn from different people and when they able to, saw that they are so many, they also can make friends, they are people who also support them. They are people who enjoy talking to them or being with them, who can share their food with them or they can eat from the same plate in which she is eating and they can sleep, they can sleep in the same room in which she is sleeping. So it was like, it was a moment for them. It was like giving their life back and theater had this power to heal all those things and to give them the voice.
Neelesh Singh: We saw this power in theater. That's where,people said that theater and music. Everybody, everything, all these things has power of healing, also. They can heal the pain which is there inside you. They [00:30:00] can give you a voice.
Neelesh Singh: There's a friend called Alina and she is an art therapist. So she told me that I practice art therapy. We never heard such thing called art therapy. We wanted to know what is this art therapy. So she said, 'art also has, fine arts, this also has the power of healing andfrom the art, the kind of art that you make, I can make out the kind of suffering that you are undergoing through and the kind of pain that you are feeling and all those things. And we will, I will try to heal all those thingsfrom the art only.'
Neelesh Singh: So what happened, she was at that time, she was also suffering from cancer. And while she was undergoing through
Neelesh Singh: this chemotherapy. And she couldn't have come to our place from Jharkhand, but she was living in Bangalore. So we had organized an online thing for her. We had organizeda big screen, mic, and speakers. And then she said, 'at one time I can maybe [00:31:00] start with eight or nine people.' So that was okay for us, because we also had the challenge of a bigger room anyway, so we had all those, whatever she said, if she wanted some brush and paints and newspapers and some drawing papers and all those things. So we had organized for her and she was, she used to speak in English, whereas our people, they used to understand Hindi. So we had one interpreter also with us.
Neelesh Singh: And so we would call all those eight survivors in front of the big screen. And then she said, 'you can keep all the paints in front of them, all every color in front of them.' And she would just ask him, 'okay, paint it, whatever you want and choose whatever color that you want, choose whatever brush that you want. This is a newspaper is there in front of you. You have blank papers also, you have drawing papers also. Paint whatever.' To our surprise, almost every one of them chose dark color. And while they had the choice of several colors to select from, [00:32:00] they, everyone chose only one or two color.
Neelesh Singh: We were not expert in that, but Alina, she said, 'this is studying them. This is studying the kind of that pain that they are undergoing through. This is a dark side that they have and all of them have selected only newspaper, used paper to, to draw on. So that also tells about their confidence. They didn't have the confidence to paint any blank papers or any drawing paper or wasting, so they would not take such chance.Slowly, she would interact with them. She would tell her about her own story and then try to listen to them and would try to make them open up about all those things.
Neelesh Singh: And slowly, all of them, they shifted from newspaper to actual drawing paper, and then they started using more colors and all, and then, eventually, she asked them to paint a big wall and, it wascollectively they had to paint a wall, and she said, 'the larger is the picture, the louder the voice is about,' because they are communicating through their painting. [00:33:00] That's what they are doing.
Neelesh Singh: It was our collective's office, our,the women collective's office, they offered her their wall, office wall to them that you can paint your picture here. So it was like collective, it was showing a collective support towards such women.
Neelesh Singh: And then, eventually the police station of that block, they offered their entire wall, the boundary wall of the entire police station to them, that you can paint your picture here, and this wall is for you. So it was like entering into the police station and painting their walls and all those things which had never, and they had never been to police station before that.
Neelesh Singh: I think that, that was like working for them. That was encouraged Other part of the districts, other part of the state also to came for who came forward who wanted you know this thing so Alinashe gave us, started giving us two days in a week for two other districts.
Sarah Jack: So that's how we scaled it up, and [00:34:00] all those who got healed, who said that they are now healed. Then we had on a, in a residential mode. So we had this three, four days of workshop, drawing workshop train them on a special kind of painting called Sohrai painting and Kohvar painting. There were two kinds of regional painting, which was of Jharkhand. They would start training on them. So they were trained on these two kinds of painting. And then we got this chance to take this painting to the exhibition And there they selected this painting and we, when we had called a state level workshop to share our story, to share the story of our strategies with the rest of the world. So there we had this chance to givetheir painting as gift to the honorable guest of that workshop. And they were, they feel quite proud and accepting that as a gift. I'm really hearing today how pulling people together and then [00:35:00] finding a way to give somebody their humanity and then this collective, this coming alongside and then giving humanity back is like a start.
Neelesh Singh: In one of the village, I think it was, around 60 year old lady, she was called as witch by other women of that village. And also male people of that village. And all of them, they stripped this woman naked in front of the village. And then they applied some black color on her face and made her parade around the village and all those things. It was in the full daylight, and her son, was such helpless, he wanted to help his mother butcouldn't do that. And his friend stopped him from doing such thing.And [00:36:00] we had this collective in every village and there is a federation called cluster level federation, which is like a federation of 20 or 25 villages, like after that it federates into a cluster level federation. So this cluster level federation had 21 village under that federation, and in one of the village, this thing happened.This collective of 21 village, they took the decision to felicitate that lady and to show their support towards that lady and they took out rally from each of their village and they brought the clothes and money and some food grains and some flour and everything, and then theyfelicitated that lady in front of every villager and they showered her with the food or and the clothes.
Neelesh Singh: They said that since your clothes was stripped by these people, so every village is offering you these clothes now to you, and this is to honor you [00:37:00] and to support you and to give this message to all the villages here that nothing will ever happen to you, and nothing will happen to any of the persons here. We all, collectives are here to support everyone. From now on, if anyone tries to call anyone as witch, then we will take action against that person. We'll take that person behind the bar with the help of police and everyone, and this was almost for the first time that people were showing support to anybody called witch. Before that, they had never seen anyone supporting witch such openly in such an open forum. And here it was like people coming from every corner of the villages and rallying against that incident. And then it was reported in media, it was reported in TV and newspapers. And so everybody was talking about such support.
Neelesh Singh: So [00:38:00] that gave a strength to them, and they wanted their chief minister, the head of the state to give this statement that he won't tolerate this malpractice of witch-branding and witch-hunting. And he vows to make the state free from witch-branding and witch-hunting. They wanted the chief minister to give out this statement. So that incident of one particular village sparked the other collective of living in different parts of that state for carrying out a signature campaign against this signature was taking the signature of every officials also, and then I think more than 50,000 signature was shared with the chief minister asking him to give this statement. And then he gave this statement and also asked the department to work against witch-hunting and witch-branding practices and make this a state free from this. Share with me the strategy that you have for this. So it was very [00:39:00] encouraging for our women.
Josh Hutchinson:
Neelesh Singh: One more thing which I would like to share is that while all these things,working with government, it's important, because what happens while we are working with NGOs, we, somehow, we can work in some pockets, we can work in smaller geography, but it is important that it's a responsibility of the state and the state must realize it is their work, finally, to make this country free from such a horrendous practice. So giving importance to such a thing is, I think, we have to create this agency of such survivor. We need to build this network of all those survivors of witch-hunting and make their agency so that they can talk, sit with the government, and make the policy for themselves. And talk with the media, sit in the media, and tell the media that this is a very [00:40:00] important issue and they must raise about this issue. While it's okay that you cover so many other things, but this is also an important issue. So please do cover that. So I think that's important for us to build an agency of such survivors. So while we have identified so many survivors, I think it's a long way to go to form their agency.
Josh Hutchinson: And now for a minute with Mary.
Mary-Louise Bingham: On behalf of End Witch Hunts, I am pleased to tell our listeners that I will be working with Neelesh Singh and his team as we help the survivors of witch hunts to tell their stories through music, art, and theater. As I hold a degree in music education with a background in piano and voice studies, I will work within the team to help the survivors find their voices through song.
Mary-Louise Bingham: I am honored. I may be a small part of helping them find their voice, but the survivors and the more experienced team members will teach me so [00:41:00] much more beyond my current comprehension. I also have the full support of our board members, Sarah Jack, Joshua Hutchinson, Beth Caruso, and Jen Stevenson, who will do whatever they can to help in this endeavor. After all, whenever one of us reaches out to make a difference, we do so not only as individuals, but as a board of strong advocates who will help each other to actively make a difference.
Sarah Jack: Thank you, Mary.
Josh Hutchinson: Sarah has End Witch Hunts news.
Sarah Jack: End Witch Hunts, a non profit 501c3 organization, Weekly News Update. Trial by ordeal is an ancient practice where the guilt or innocence of an accused person is determined through a physically or mentally challenging test. It has been a method of justice throughout history, reflecting deeply rooted beliefs in divine intervention and the supernatural.
Sarah Jack: Trials by ordeal, which depend on supernatural beliefs and physical tests to [00:42:00] ascertain guilt or innocence, lack the procedural fairness and evidentiary standards we expect in modern legal systems. Despite this, even the more formal witch trials of history were not immune to these practices, incorporating superstitious beliefs and physical tests to determine guilt. This enduring fear of witchcraft, along with the intention to prove malicious acts, highlights a continuous thread in human history. When such practices emerge in today's society, they echo historical precedents, revealing an ongoing struggle to balance myth with the principles of justice.
Sarah Jack: Guinea-Bissau is a country of Western Africa situated on the Atlantic coast. It is about 44.1 percent urban and 55.9 percent rural. As of 2022, male life expectancy was averaging 61.5 years and female life expectancy was 66 years. In 2022, their female population amounted to approximately 1.07 million, while the male population amounted to approximately [00:43:00] 1.04 million.
Sarah Jack: The Advocacy for Alleged Witches, spearheaded by Leo Igwe, is sounding the alarm on an urgent human rights issue in this African country. There was an incident this month, February 2024, in the Culade region of Cacheu. Here, eight women were tragically killed and 20 other women hospitalized after being forced to consume a poisonous potion by a traditional priest to determine if they were guilty of witchcraft. These women were all over the age of 50. This incident is not isolated but indicative of a wider systemic problem that transcends time and local cultural practices and points to a global responsibility. The belief in witchcraft crimes and the barbaric practice of trial by ordeal reflect an ongoing societal failure to protect the vulnerable and uphold justice. Witch hunts, often targeting women, expose the gendered nature of this violence, revealing deep-seated misogyny and societal complicity in these acts. The call to [00:44:00] action by the Advocacy for Alleged Witches is not only a plea for the local government to intervene but a wake up call to the world. We are the world. Legal and administrative measures against those implicated in such abuses are necessary, but so is a broader societal shift to address the impunity that allows this violence to continue. The introduction of emergency helplines and targeted actions against perpetrators are steps in the right direction. However, these actions must be a part of a larger concerted effort to stop superstitious accusations with education, protect the rights of women and vulnerable populations, and fundamentally change how societies, how the world views and addresses harmful acts due to accusations of witchcraft. This incident is a stark reminder that the fight against gender-based violence and the persecution of alleged witches is not solely the responsibility of Guinea-Bissau or any single nation. It is a global challenge that demands a unified response from all corners of the world.
Sarah Jack: Thank you for listening today. Thank you for your [00:45:00] financial gifts. Visit aboutwitchhunts.com/ to donate any amount you're comfortable with. Your generosity is the backbone of the podcast content you value. Let's commit to making a difference together.
Josh Hutchinson: Thank you, Sarah.
Sarah Jack: You're welcome.
Josh Hutchinson: And thank you for listening to Witch Hunt.
Sarah Jack: Keep the conversation going in your sphere until you join us next week.
Josh Hutchinson: Have a great today and a beautiful tomorrow.